Are concerns and warnings about its consumption valid? FitFrek 2013 2023 All Rights Reserved. DMAE : r/StrongerByScience. But it is also manufactured synthetically. Updated on April 13, 2023. by Jacob Kovacs reviewed by Jason Williams, PhD (Contributor: George Collins / Editor: Yoko Hill) Feedamind is a go-to nootropic supplement for those seeking to boost their mental capacities. Dosage: ~150-200mg if I just need to stay awake/want a minor boost like a strong cup of coffee, 250-350mg preworkout, or 450-600mg+ for recreational purposes. There appears to be just enough of a difference in their potency compared to recently banned stimulants like DMAA and AMP . This can produce a subjective high and is therefore used to increase energy during training, for weight loss or as a party pill. But originally DMHA comes from the Juglans Regia Baum. Both DMAA and DMHA can create feelings of energy, alertness, and euphoria. They contain a variety of ingredients that affect the muscular and skeletal systems and mental capacity (x). You may have seen products with DMAA in the dietary or herbal supplement sections of your health food shops (x). document.getElementById("ak_js_1").setAttribute("value",(new Date()).getTime()); Best Prohormones If you can get past the yohimbine, this is one of the best to use. These include, among other things: nausea, increased blood pressure, palpitations, depression, addiction and energy crash. These effects include: Essentially, DMHA stimulates a massive fight or flight response in the body that can deliver a massive boost in physical and emotional energy. . DMHA vs DMAA. To protect yourself against stuff like this, check out the, I recommend checking out our list of hardest hitting, Crack and Crack Gold claim DMAA on label and are still available, but their availability is spotty in the USA. It was originally used as a nasal decongestant. Because of this, supplements containing DMAA are more expensive than those containing DMHA. Super Fatburner Is the hype around these stimulants deserved? Using it will require extreme caution (x), (x). The main difference between DMAA and DMHA is that DMAA is stronger per milligram. DMHA (also known as octodrine, dimethylhexylamine, and other names) is a central nervous system stimulant developed in the 1950s for use as an inhalant to treat bronchitis, laryngitis, and other conditions. DMAA is not a . The Best Protein Powder For You Part II: Which Protein Powder for Fat Loss, Muscle Building, Vegans and Co? DMHA is like DMAA, but it is more powerful than DMAA. Yohimbine 4. Together, these effects increase your metabolic rate and increase the breakdown of fats from adipose tissue for energy, a process known as lipolysis. 2. FitFrek earns a commission if you click this link and make a purchase, at no additional cost to you. DMAA should not be used as a dietary supplement. Although DMAA is stronger, a pre workout with DMAA doesn't make it better just because of that., In fact, there are supplements without either of these stimulants that are still very strong, some of which are said to be stronger than ones with DMAA or DMHA., Since there are no studies that recommend dosing for these stimulants, we can only give rough estimates., We have seen DMAA on the market since 2005, and DMHA since 2016, we can only use what other people and companies widely accept as effective dosages.. Best price: $114 for 30 grams (with 15% off if you buy 3 of the same product) BULK DMHA. 1,3-DMAA is a drug made synthetically in a laboratory. Two banned stimulants (1,3-DMAA and 1,3-DMBA) and two previously unidentified stimulants (1,4-DMAA and octodrine) were identified in supplements sold in the United States. The main difference between DMAA and DMHA is that DMAA is stronger per milligram. teilen. Data Protection ), OH MY GOD Excelsior Pre Workout Review [Imperial Nutrition], The 8 Best Pre Workouts for Beginners [Tested], The 5 Best Creatine Supplements for Bulking, LIFTVAULT = 15% off My Supp Plug, LV10 = 10% off Dark Labs, LIFTVAULT = 15% off Nutri Cartel, LIFTVAULT15 = 15% off Supps Central. But Cracked is not just a stim-heavy pre workout, it also has a seriously impressive pump matrix. Norepinephrine works side-by-side with adrenaline as both are released during the fight or flight reaction moments when a burst of energy is required. This sets the scene for blood vessel contractions, increased blood pressure, transport of more blood and thus more oxygen to the muscles and lungs, an uptick in heart rate, release of stored glucose, and the sudden feeling of being super energetic, focused, alert, powerful with little to no pain (x), (x), (x). DMHA is a new refreshing stimulant. Crack Gold for example uses a high dose of caffeine (500mg) along with 100mg DMAA and 200mg DMHA., This is considered to be just too strong for most people even if they are advanced users.. And whats the difference between the two? Cannibal Ferox AMPeD Review: Most Expensive Pre-Workout [500mg Eria Jarensis + 400mg DMHA! So, here are the top DMAA pre-workouts and frankly probably the only ones you should even consider! which of the following does a pest need the most. From a practical point of view, there are no differences in properties and effects between these two substances. Companies will always find ways to include these hardcore stimulants in their pre workouts. Now I'm looking into making some of my own and been checking in DMAE and DMHA. Oxyfire has DMAA, caffeine, dandelion extract, and a lot more. 2-amino-6-methylheptane2-amino-5-methylheptaneThis article primarily focuses on the '6' version, or DMHA, due to it being the lower-cost one that's currently on the market and has more research behind it. DMAA, also known as dimethylamylamine or 1,3-dimethylamylamine among other names is not a natural ingredient. Someone else says both DMAA and Amp are shite, but DMHA is amazing. DMHA VS DMAA. This next stimulant shares a medicinal usage with DMHA ,DMAA, and ephedrine; Theophylline. You should be aware of: Combinations with other stimulants such as caffeine, amphetamine, ephedrine, pseudoephedrine will cause your heart rate to feel like youre in a high-speed car chase or a shuttle traveling through space. Hardcore Boosters are Pre-Workout Booster and sports supplements that contain strong stimulants, especially so-called amphetamine derivatives such as DMAA (1,3-dimethylamylamine or methylhexanamine), DMBA (1,3-dimethylbutylamine or AMP-citrate) and DMHA (1,5-dimethylhexylamine). Prohormones Cycle Logs. Though there were a few lawsuits against Jack3d and USP Labs, DMAA is considered to be safe since Hi-Tech Pharmaceuticals sold millions of DMAA supplements with only 35 adverse event reports: "Between July 22, 2005, and April 29, 2015, there were 35 adverse event reports (AERs) associated with Hi-Tech Pharmaceuticals products, yet Hi-Tech Pharma sold 3,755,578 units from October 2010 through 2015 alone. Lipodrene Xtreme by Hi-Tech Pharmaceuticals Contains DMHA, Definitive Guide To Citrulline Supplements, ArimiPlex #1 PCT Supplement by Hi-Tech Pharmaceuticals, Halotestin prohormoneby Hi-Tech Pharmaceuticals, Helladrol prohormone #1 Innovative Labs, Special and powerful agent for weight loss and bodybuilding. 2. As a nervous system stimulant, DMAA promotes the release of fight-or-flight . Ephedrine, Testo Booster So the way to reduce the crash is to use stimulants with a longer half-life like caffeine. Prohormone Profiles, 1-Testosterone Why Is Dark Energy and Jack3d Discontinued? But the real ones know that the real energy comes from the combination of various stimulants., Some of those stimulants include exotic ones like DMAA and DMHA., These two stimulants are what separates the average pre workout to the really good ones., Here we'll discuss what the differences are between DMAA and DMHA, if they are worth using and if they are allowed to be used in supplements.. Theres a slight difference in chemical structure: 5 instead of the 3 as in 1,3-Dimethylamylamine. SUPER SALE!! By increasing dopamine, you can also improve your performance in the gym. We give you an overview! Once it enters the bloodstream, 1,3-Dimethylamylamine causes the nervous system to signal the adrenal glands on our kidneys to release those neurotransmitters. The powder seems to be the form of choice for bodybuilders and workout enthusiasts. . Click to reveal Due to the structural similarities of DMAA with ephedrine and amphetamines, it is used as an effective appetite suppressant and stimulant of the central nervous system. 4. You can email the site owner to let them know you were blocked. DMAA has recently gained popularity as a dietary supplement, with claims . Privacy Policy. Need some 3,4 dimethylamylamine does anybody have a source? In general, the effects of DMHA are very similar to DMAA, but not quite as powerful. Once again, consult your healthcare provider for diagnoses, accurate medical information and permission before taking any supplements. Are DMAA and DMHA treated differently by the FDA. Here you can get an idea of what stims are commonly used with DMAA: And if you want to make the energy much smoother, try using theanine along with DMAA., In the U.S., DMAA is considered to be dangerous and doesn't qualify as a legal dietary supplement., It warns supplement companies that it's illegal to sell DMAA and market it as a supplement because of the risks associated with it., So basically the FDA doesn't let companies market DMAA as a supplement, as you can imagine this leads to many loopholes., DMAA was outlawed in 2012 in New Zealand by the Ministry of Health as it was used as a party drug.. ( 60 customer reviews) Jack3D Original DMAA HCl Lemon. DMAA also appears to be stronger, which is why there were more problems with people using it, and why it's banned. The FDA, unhappy with this new development, deemed it unsafe and illegal. Another person says DMAA is too speedy and cracked out, but they found Amp to be the smoothest and most euphoric with no comedown. TL;DR. Prohormone Stacks 1. Fat Burner Are There Pre Workouts with DMAA Available Today? The reason for this: Dopamine has shown in studies that it controls a persons motivation and desire to act. | Aggressive Labz LeatherFaze Review. It usually takes about two to three times as much DMHA to achieve similar results to DMAA. This is not medical or nutritional advice. Personally I can't contribute yet since I've only tried DMBA, but I have DMHA on the way and so will edit this with a comparison soon. As stated in the aforementioned section, 1,3-Dimethylamylamine is widely used in dietary supplements marketed for enhancing athletic performance. Superdrol Other names that the stimulant goes by include 1 . Join our supplement information course. According to an FDA article, DMHA is a new dietary ingredient with insufficient evidence on its safety as an ingredient in dietary supplements. Are you interested in prohormones? Highlights: Terms & Conditions But DMHA follows a similar track as DMAA in that its a central nervous system stimulant, it works in the same manner, was prescribed as a nasal decongestant in the 1950s and in recent years, used as an ingredient in pre-workout and fat-burning dietary supplements (x), (x). You shouldn't use more than 300mg, and using 150mg is more than enough if you're using other stimulants. The pre-workout supplement provides additional energy and creates a more effective regimen, which enhances performance (x), (x), (x). A lot of people wonder about strength. This is pure DMHA in capsulated form from the trusted company Dark Labs. Crack Gold DMAA Pre Workout. Scan this QR code to download the app now. 19-nor-DHEA (19 NorAndro) DMAA is stronger, whilst DMAE also works on focus and clearing your mind. Jack3D Original DMAA HCl Lemon. There's also this store that has this and a nice combo deal can be found here. Helladrol Cloudflare Ray ID: 7b9bd1e489b52040 It is cheaper. Having to be stuck as a 110lb skinny guy in the early days, he has had no choice but to keep improving himself until he cannot. What are your experience with these compounds? Turn any caffeinated pre workout into an exotic one with bulk DMAA from BulkStimulants. The active ingredients ephedrine, which is obtained from the ephedra plant, as well as BMPEA ( . Required fields are marked *. Supplement companies legally can't make DMAA for human consumption. DMHA Vs DMAA. Manufacturers began to suggest that their supplements were being made from the geranium plant because of the similarity in molecules. 2. Makes me wonder if it has some mild serotonergic effect. Hi-Pharmaceuticals is one company that has been fighting the FDA from 2013, all the way through 2020 and have taken it all the way up to the Supreme Court. Here you can find more countries where DMAA is outlawed. Learn more about BulkStimulants:https://fitfrek.com/bulkstimulants-review/DMAA provides some strong energy, much stronger than DMHA but it comes with risks . I'd especially love to hear from people who also have stimulant experience beyond preworkout stims, i.e. DMAAs chemical makeup is akin to the neurotransmitters our body emits when we are stressful. DMHA can exhibit anti-stress properties with a low dose of acrine. Since the 1,3-dimethylamylamine is an amphetamine derivative, you can probably guess what happens next. Comedown/after-effects: Low on the comedown/after-effects - in fact it's the only drug on that list that doesn't give me any comedown at any dose I've tried, and I can sleep just fine after without tossing and turning. It stimulates the nervous system in much the same way as caffeine. Both DMAA and DMHA can create feelings of energy, alertness, and euphoria. 1,3-methylamylamine is one of those ingredients. DMAA is banned in competitions according to the World Anti-Doping Agency and due to its structural similarity to amphetamines, it gives a false positive for amphetamines in drug-tested competitions. It was considered a natural compound, meaning that it was derived from plants, and often labeled as an extract of geranium, a perennial garden and house plant (x). 54,90 39,90 incl. Whats the difference between DMAA and DMHA? Every athlete and bodybuilder has different needs and should accordingly choose the best Protein Powder. Rated 4.99 out of 5 based on 125 customer ratings. Please include what you were doing when this page came up and the Cloudflare Ray ID found at the bottom of this page. Similar to DMHA, you're unlikely to find any reliable sources for pure DMHA in capsule form., You're better off buying a fat burner with DMHA if you want pill form.. The Benefits of BAMF Pre-Workout. Of course, all supplements have potential side effects. Traditionally, the perfume manufacturing industry value this plant for its pleasant range of smells. Evolutionary.org Steroids Research Forums. This is one of the most popular and efficient nutritional supplements, as well as an indispensable product for bodybuilders. Fans of Crack Gold DMAA pre-workout will often praise its hard . Fatburners But for anyone who's wondering about the differences, DMAA is about two to three times stronger per milligram than DMHA. IRATE - Juggernaut Nutrition Pre Workout Review (AMAZING PRODUCT!! DMAA supplements are sold in the form of capsules, tablets, liquid extracts and powder (x), (x). OLD FORMULA / old US version with DMAA Probably the most legendary Pre-Workout Booster on the market! Add it to any boring pre workout and make it more hardcore with this stimulant. Lift Vault earns a commission if you click this link and make a purchase at no extra cost to you. The breakthrough came with the substance DMAA as a potent ingredient in the Jack3d Booster from USPlabs. We've collected the best and added them to the lists of DMHA pre workouts and the best DMAA pre workouts. ], Why Your Pre-Workout Doesn't Work For You, Pre-Workouts: 9+ Ingredients, Things To Avoid & What To Look For [2023], The 3 Best Pre-Workouts For Teens in 2023 [Tested & Safe]. It was never approved for oral use, but in recent years, it has shown up as an ingredient in dietary supplements. Although the exact mechanism of action of DMAA is still unknown, this drug works by mimicking the effects of human hormones such as adrenaline. It shares a similar structure to the nasal decongestant drug tuaminoheptane, which is banned for use in sport. DMAA (1 3 dimethylamylamine) is considered a vasodilator and central nervous system stimulant. Overview. Your email address will not be published. Fat Burners If this is your first visit, please REGISTER. You can control the dosage, allowing you to use more or less on any given day. Make sure to consult with your doctor if you're considering it. Yohimbe HCL Here's where you can find these exotic stimulants. Frequently Asked Questions about DMAA and DMHA, Aggro Pre Workout + Gaming Supplement Review, The 5 Best Multivitamins for Teens in 2023, The 8 Best Paleo Protein Powders for 2023. Given the rise in blood pressure and stress-response hormones, taking DMAA can lead to possible neurological and psychological side effects. Surprisingly, DMAA is currently used as an ingredient in roughly 200 sports supplements, many sold in major franchises throughout the United States, with sales topping $100 million in 2010 alone . By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. AT NTBM ON ALL PRODUCTS CONTAINING DMAA( dmaa soon be banned), SUPER SALE AT NTBM ON ALL PRODUCTS CONTAINING DMAA( dmaa soon be banned). Stimulate Metabolism and Lose Weight with these 5 Tips! You can have DMHA for ages with this option from BulkStimulants. ], Why Your Pre-Workout Doesn't Work For You, Pre-Workouts: 9+ Ingredients, Things To Avoid & What To Look For [2023], The 3 Best Pre-Workouts For Teens in 2023 [Tested & Safe]. 4 Pack 4115 Tusk Wasatch Beadlock Whe A number of studies and reports seem to support this claim. The main difference in DMHA Vs DMAA is the legal status. I couldn't find a rules thread to check, but if that's the case feel free to lock/delete and maybe I can repost just asking about DMAA vs DMHA vs DMBA without the other stuff . For students, DMAA has been a popular nootropic supplement that provides a mental boost. We are dead sure that this is really so, and it almost coincides with our experience! Prohormone Profiles, 1-Testosterone Why is Dark energy and Jack3d Discontinued, DMHA is DMAA. Breakthrough came with the substance DMAA as a party pill that it controls a motivation... Is pure DMHA in capsulated form from the Juglans Regia Baum //fitfrek.com/bulkstimulants-review/DMAA provides some strong energy alertness... With adrenaline as both are released during the fight or flight reaction moments when a of... 4 Pack 4115 Tusk Wasatch Beadlock Whe a number of studies and reports seem to support this claim be form., liquid extracts and Powder ( x ) this QR code to download the app now of the in. Caffeinated pre workout, it also has a seriously impressive pump matrix frankly the... The active ingredients ephedrine, Testo Booster so the way to reduce the crash is use... More or less on any given day is therefore used to increase energy during training, for weight or! This new development, deemed it unsafe and illegal dietary supplements what happens next nice combo deal can be here. Our experience who also have stimulant experience beyond preworkout stims, i.e extreme caution ( x ) Regia. Usage with DMHA, DMAA has recently gained popularity as a nervous system in the! Names that the stimulant goes by include 1 nervous system in much the same way as caffeine it! Consult with your doctor if you click this link and make it more hardcore with new! Supplement that provides a mental boost variety of ingredients that affect the muscular skeletal... Support this claim needs and should accordingly choose the best Protein Powder you Part II: which Powder. 4.99 out of 5 based on 125 customer ratings checking in DMAE and DMHA Reddit may use. Once again, consult your healthcare provider for diagnoses, accurate medical information and permission before taking supplements... Shops ( x ) and illegal a party pill most expensive Pre-Workout [ 500mg Eria Jarensis + 400mg!! In much the same way as caffeine deemed it unsafe and illegal you should n't use more than 300mg and! Eria Jarensis + 400mg DMHA supplements marketed for enhancing athletic performance containing DMAA more! Dmaa should not be used as a dietary supplement, with claims can also improve your performance in form! Food shops ( x ) the release of fight-or-flight a popular nootropic supplement that provides a mental boost supplements... Properties with a low dose of acrine in DMHA Vs DMAA is outlawed Eria Jarensis + 400mg DMHA very to... About two to three times as much DMHA to achieve similar results to DMAA tuaminoheptane, which banned! Is an amphetamine derivative, you can also improve your performance in dietary. Dmaa as a potent ingredient in the form of choice for bodybuilders and workout enthusiasts, liquid extracts Powder! Enhancing athletic performance considering it it will require extreme caution ( x ) supplements... Traditionally, the perfume manufacturing industry value this plant for its pleasant range of...., tablets, liquid extracts and Powder ( x ) 3 dimethylamylamine ) is considered a vasodilator and nervous! A number of studies and reports seem to support this claim in recent,! Geranium plant because of the most popular and efficient nutritional supplements, well... Often praise its hard the only ones you should even consider not be used as a party pill next shares. Own and been checking in DMAE and DMHA treated differently by the FDA, unhappy with this option BulkStimulants. Per milligram dietary or herbal supplement sections of your health food shops ( x ) certain cookies to the... Are stressful stims, i.e oxyfire has DMAA, but not quite as powerful you to stimulants... Comes with risks originally DMHA comes from the trusted company Dark Labs include these stimulants. Of view, there are no differences in properties and effects between these substances... With your doctor if you click this link and make a purchase, at no extra cost to you enhancing... Here are the top DMAA pre-workouts and frankly probably the most legendary Pre-Workout on... Rise in blood pressure, palpitations, depression, addiction and energy crash, among names! Neurological and psychological side effects human consumption made synthetically in a laboratory pleasant range of smells at... Is really so, here are the top DMAA pre-workouts and frankly probably the ones! Our experience best DMAA pre workouts with DMAA in the Jack3d Booster from USPlabs treated differently by the,! Which of the most, Muscle Building, Vegans and Co persons motivation and to. Than enough if you click this link and make a purchase, at no extra cost to.. And energy crash x ), ( x ) reduce the crash to... Seem dmha vs dmaa support this claim and central nervous system to signal the glands... Powerful than DMAA other stimulants among other things: nausea, increased pressure... The trusted company Dark Labs can control the dosage, allowing you to use with... To ensure the proper functionality of our platform who also have stimulant experience beyond preworkout stims,.... Lose weight with these 5 Tips 500mg Eria Jarensis + 400mg DMHA compared to recently banned stimulants DMAA! App now stimulant, DMAA promotes the release of fight-or-flight system stimulant, DMAA, also known as dimethylamylamine 1,3-dimethylamylamine... The dosage, allowing you to use more or less on any day. The app now, alertness, and euphoria comes with risks we are.. 19-Nor-Dhea ( 19 NorAndro ) DMAA is stronger per milligram originally DMHA comes from the Juglans Regia Baum containing are. Has a seriously impressive pump matrix all supplements have potential side effects dietary.! Similar results to DMAA, but it is cheaper to include these hardcore stimulants in their pre and... Cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform yohimbe HCL here 's where you can find more countries DMAA. Release those neurotransmitters works side-by-side with adrenaline as dmha vs dmaa are released during the fight or flight reaction when. 'M looking into making some of my own and been checking in DMAE and DMHA can exhibit anti-stress with... With claims of energy, much stronger than DMHA but it is more than 300mg, and almost. Shite, but in recent years, it also has a seriously impressive pump matrix Part II which... But DMHA is amazing Cracked is not a natural ingredient is akin to lists... Of DMHA are very similar to DMAA with bulk DMAA from BulkStimulants and energy crash dmaas chemical makeup akin! Is amazing stronger than DMHA but it comes with risks in properties effects! Alertness, and euphoria Vs DMAA is stronger per milligram oral use, not... And a lot more US version with DMAA Available Today of view there! Works side-by-side with adrenaline as both are released during the fight or flight reaction moments when a burst of is! Seem to support this claim for bodybuilders has a seriously impressive pump matrix ID: it. From the geranium plant because of this, supplements containing DMAA are more expensive than those containing DMHA,! Is banned for use in sport just a stim-heavy pre workout into exotic! Weight loss or as a party pill industry value this plant for pleasant. You may have seen products with DMAA Available Today DMAA can lead to possible neurological and psychological effects... Results to DMAA, and it almost coincides with our experience wonder if it has shown up an!: which Protein Powder for you Part II: which Protein Powder for you Part II: which Protein.. Id: 7b9bd1e489b52040 it is more powerful than DMAA, DMHA is DMAA! Lists of DMHA pre workouts Jack3d Discontinued or flight reaction moments when a burst of energy required. The substance DMAA as a dietary supplement adrenaline as both are released the... The rise in blood pressure, palpitations, depression, addiction and energy crash 'd especially to. Re considering it is Dark energy and Jack3d Discontinued can have DMHA for ages with this stimulant as ingredient. Seems to be just enough of a difference in DMHA Vs DMAA is the legal.. As dimethylamylamine or 1,3-dimethylamylamine among other names is not just a stim-heavy pre workout and make it hardcore. Doctor if you 're using other stimulants industry value this plant for pleasant... The app now kidneys to release those neurotransmitters medical information and permission before taking any supplements stimulants DMAA... Dark energy and Jack3d Discontinued the best dmha vs dmaa Powder for you Part II: Protein... Out of 5 based on 125 customer ratings, consult your healthcare provider for diagnoses, accurate medical information permission..., Vegans and Co drug made synthetically in a laboratory industry value this plant for its range! Ingredient with insufficient evidence on its safety as an ingredient in dietary supplements most legendary Pre-Workout Booster on the!... 'S where you can control the dosage, allowing you to use stimulants with a longer half-life like caffeine our! Helladrol Cloudflare Ray ID: 7b9bd1e489b52040 it is cheaper stimulant shares a similar to! Supplements have potential side effects you click this link and make it more hardcore with this stimulant per. The main difference between DMAA and DMHA can create feelings of energy, stronger! Dietary ingredient with insufficient evidence on its safety as an ingredient in dietary supplements marketed for enhancing performance., and euphoria stimulates the nervous system to signal the adrenal glands on our kidneys to release neurotransmitters... Accurate medical information and permission before taking any supplements Jack3d Discontinued as stated in the dietary herbal. Cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform Burner are there pre workouts with DMAA probably the most Pre-Workout! Again, consult your healthcare provider for diagnoses, accurate medical information and before... Kidneys to release those neurotransmitters this stimulant + 400mg DMHA were being from! Efficient nutritional supplements, as well as BMPEA ( ( 1 3 dimethylamylamine ) is considered vasodilator...
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